730826 - Conversation - London - Revision history

RasaRasika at 05:30, 13 December 2023

2023-12-13T05:30:22Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:30, 13 December 2023
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' Oh, yes. That is the Kṛṣṇa conscious movement. We can train from the tenth-class men to the first-class men. This is Kṛṣṇa conscious. What to speak of fourth class, fifth class—any lowest class, ''ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ'' ([[BG 9.32 (1972)\|BG 9.32]])		'''Prabhupāda:''' Oh, yes. That is the Kṛṣṇa conscious movement. We can train from the tenth-class men to the first-class men. This is Kṛṣṇa conscious. What to speak of fourth class, fifth class—any lowest class, ''ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ'' ([[BG 9.32 (1972)\|BG 9.32]])

	(aside:) Find out this verse: ''māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya'' . . .		(aside) Find out this verse: ''māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya'' . . .

	Somebody must be quick. ''Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ. Māṁ, m-a-m. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya.''		Somebody must be quick. ''Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ. Māṁ, m-a-m. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya.''
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' This is the way going on. The whole cosmic manifestation, that is described in the ''Bhagavad-gītā'', ''viśva-rūpa''. Just like I am a form. So I have got many parts—the fingers are there, the hairs are there, the nails are there. So many things. If you make analytical study the anatomy or physiology, you will get so many parts. Innumerable. So this body, somebody studies as psychologist. He is simply studying the brain. Somebody is physiologist. Somebody is a biologist. The same . . . center is the body. Center is the body.		'''Prabhupāda:''' This is the way going on. The whole cosmic manifestation, that is described in the ''Bhagavad-gītā'', ''viśva-rūpa''. Just like I am a form. So I have got many parts—the fingers are there, the hairs are there, the nails are there. So many things. If you make analytical study the anatomy or physiology, you will get so many parts. Innumerable. So this body, somebody studies as psychologist. He is simply studying the brain. Somebody is physiologist. Somebody is a biologist. The same . . . center is the body. Center is the body.

	They have made so many departmental knowledge, but if there is any such process to know what is this body, then is it not possible to know everything? ''Yasmin vijñāte'' . . . that is the Vedic instruction: ''yasmin vijñāte sarvam evam vijñātaṁ bhavati'' (''Muṇḍaka Upaniṣad'' 1.1.3). If you understand the Absolute Truth, then other, relative truths become automatically known. So those who are interested with the relative truth, they are intelligent? Or one who is interested in the Absolute Truth, he is intelligent?		They have made so many departmental knowledge, but if there is any such process to know what is this body, then is it not possible to know everything? ''Yasmin vijñāte'' . . . that is the Vedic instruction: ''yasmin vijñāte sarvam evam vijñātaṁ bhavati'' (Muṇḍaka Upaniṣad 1.1.3). If you understand the Absolute Truth, then other, relative truths become automatically known. So those who are interested with the relative truth, they are intelligent? Or one who is interested in the Absolute Truth, he is intelligent?

	'''Guest:''' Hmm. It just seems to be a particular problem to find one's way among lots of different groups that express themselves in exactly the way that you do. Because there are very many, and that's . . .		'''Guest:''' Hmm. It just seems to be a particular problem to find one's way among lots of different groups that express themselves in exactly the way that you do. Because there are very many, and that's . . .
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	'''Guest:''' They will say that too.		'''Guest:''' They will say that too.

	'''Prabhupāda:''' So if you can understand the Absolute Truth, the relative truths become automatically known. This is Vedic injunction. ''Yasmin vijñāte sarvam evaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavati'' (''Muṇḍaka Upaniṣad'' 1.1.3). By knowing the Absolute Truth . . . just like, take another example, analogy. In the mathematics 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 0. So if you simply learn this, then you learn the whole mathematics, because whatever you write in mathematics is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, in this way and that way, say plus, minus, division, but they are nothing but 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 . . . you simply make different angle of vision of studying, but the figures are the same—1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9.		'''Prabhupāda:''' So if you can understand the Absolute Truth, the relative truths become automatically known. This is Vedic injunction. ''Yasmin vijñāte sarvam evaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavati'' (Muṇḍaka Upaniṣad 1.1.3). By knowing the Absolute Truth . . . just like, take another example, analogy. In the mathematics 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 0. So if you simply learn this, then you learn the whole mathematics, because whatever you write in mathematics is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, in this way and that way, say plus, minus, division, but they are nothing but 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 . . . you simply make different angle of vision of studying, but the figures are the same—1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9.

	'''Dhanañjaya:''' Everything else is simply a combination of . . .		'''Dhanañjaya:''' Everything else is simply a combination of . . .

RasaRasika: Text replacement - "Śrutakīrti:" to "'''Śrutakīrti:'''"

2023-09-08T01:28:03Z

Text replacement - "Śrutakīrti:" to "'''Śrutakīrti:'''"

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:28, 8 September 2023
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	Somebody must be quick. ''Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ. Māṁ, m-a-m. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya.''		Somebody must be quick. ''Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ. Māṁ, m-a-m. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya.''

	Śrutakīrti: ''Māṁ hi pārtha'' . . .?		'''Śrutakīrti:''' ''Māṁ hi pārtha'' . . .?

	'''Prabhupāda:''' ''Vyapāśritya''.		'''Prabhupāda:''' ''Vyapāśritya''.

	Śrutakīrti: . . . ''vyapāśritya''.		'''Śrutakīrti:''' . . . ''vyapāśritya''.

	:''. . . ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ''		:''. . . ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ''
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	(aside) Read the purport.		(aside) Read the purport.

	Śrutakīrti: "It is clearly declared here by the Supreme Lord that in devotional service there is no distinction between the lower or higher classes of people. In the material conception of life there are such divisions, but for a person engaged in transcendental devotional service to the Lord there are not."		'''Śrutakīrti:''' "It is clearly declared here by the Supreme Lord that in devotional service there is no distinction between the lower or higher classes of people. In the material conception of life there are such divisions, but for a person engaged in transcendental devotional service to the Lord there are not."

	"Everyone is eligible for the supreme destination. In the ''Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam'' ([[SB 2.4.18\|SB 2.4.18]]) it is stated that even the lowest, who are called ''caṇḍālas'' (dog-eaters), can be elevated by association with a pure devotee. Therefore devotional service and guidance of a pure devotee are so strong that there is no discrimination between the lower and higher classes of men; anyone can take to it. The most simple man taking center of the pure devotee can be purified by proper guidance."		"Everyone is eligible for the supreme destination. In the ''Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam'' ([[SB 2.4.18\|SB 2.4.18]]) it is stated that even the lowest, who are called ''caṇḍālas'' (dog-eaters), can be elevated by association with a pure devotee. Therefore devotional service and guidance of a pure devotee are so strong that there is no discrimination between the lower and higher classes of men; anyone can take to it. The most simple man taking center of the pure devotee can be purified by proper guidance."
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' ''Āśrama'' means to teach. ''Sva-karmaṇā tam abhyarcya saṁsiddhiṁ labhate narā'' ([[BG 18.46 (1972)\|BG 18.46]]). There is verse—''sva-karmaṇā. S-v-a.''		'''Prabhupāda:''' ''Āśrama'' means to teach. ''Sva-karmaṇā tam abhyarcya saṁsiddhiṁ labhate narā'' ([[BG 18.46 (1972)\|BG 18.46]]). There is verse—''sva-karmaṇā. S-v-a.''

	Śrutakīrti: ''Sva. S-v-a.''		'''Śrutakīrti:''' ''Sva. S-v-a.''

	:''. . . yena sarvam idaṁ tatam''		:''. . . yena sarvam idaṁ tatam''

RasaRasika: Text replacement - "Revatīnandana:" to "'''Revatīnandana:'''"

2023-09-08T01:27:20Z

Text replacement - "Revatīnandana:" to "'''Revatīnandana:'''"

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	'''Prabhupāda:''' History, history can give you the statement of a few years, but creation is not like that. It is eternal. It is eternal. So you cannot give eternal evidences by your historical method. That is not possible.		'''Prabhupāda:''' History, history can give you the statement of a few years, but creation is not like that. It is eternal. It is eternal. So you cannot give eternal evidences by your historical method. That is not possible.

	Revatīnandana: What he's saying is that one way or another, history . . . regardless of what the history was, it's an irrelevant subject. History does not seem a relevant subject—whether we evolved or whether we were created does not seem important to him, but how we behave seems important to him.		'''Revatīnandana:''' What he's saying is that one way or another, history . . . regardless of what the history was, it's an irrelevant subject. History does not seem a relevant subject—whether we evolved or whether we were created does not seem important to him, but how we behave seems important to him.

	'''Prabhupāda:''' The thing is that he is also created. How he can say he can remain aloof from creation? He is created by father and mother. How you can neglect this process of creation? As soon as you accept that you are also created being, then the intelligent person, "What is the origin of creation?" That is next. If you are not interested in the origin of creation, then you are not in perfect knowledge.		'''Prabhupāda:''' The thing is that he is also created. How he can say he can remain aloof from creation? He is created by father and mother. How you can neglect this process of creation? As soon as you accept that you are also created being, then the intelligent person, "What is the origin of creation?" That is next. If you are not interested in the origin of creation, then you are not in perfect knowledge.
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	(aside) He can explain this verse, ''ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanaṁ.''		(aside) He can explain this verse, ''ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanaṁ.''

	Revatīnandana: This is the first verse of the verses composed by Lord Caitanya, who began this movement; it is present from five hundred years ago. The ''Vedas'' say that He is a incarnation of Kṛṣṇa Himself. And the verse . . .		'''Revatīnandana:''' This is the first verse of the verses composed by Lord Caitanya, who began this movement; it is present from five hundred years ago. The ''Vedas'' say that He is a incarnation of Kṛṣṇa Himself. And the verse . . .

	'''Guest:''' The ''Vedas'' five hundred years ago?		'''Guest:''' The ''Vedas'' five hundred years ago?

	Revatīnandana: It's unpredicted . . . as it is described in here . . . said that He would be actually Kṛṣṇa Himself. So He didn't write, except a few selected verses. This is the first verse, and the translation is, "All glories to the ''śrī-kṛṣṇa-saṅkīrtanam,'' chanting of the names of the Lord, because this chanting will cleanse the heart of all the dust that's accumulated there for years together. It is all the material conditioning that's been acquired from births and deaths. It is cleansed by the transcendental sound, and in this way the fire of conditional life, of repeated birth and death, is extinguished."		'''Revatīnandana:''' It's unpredicted . . . as it is described in here . . . said that He would be actually Kṛṣṇa Himself. So He didn't write, except a few selected verses. This is the first verse, and the translation is, "All glories to the ''śrī-kṛṣṇa-saṅkīrtanam,'' chanting of the names of the Lord, because this chanting will cleanse the heart of all the dust that's accumulated there for years together. It is all the material conditioning that's been acquired from births and deaths. It is cleansed by the transcendental sound, and in this way the fire of conditional life, of repeated birth and death, is extinguished."

	And the troubles with this material life, starting out with the cycle of birth and death, is likened to being in a blazing fire condition of existence. It says: "It is the life of all transcendental knowledge, this chanting." It brings it to life, the whole process. "It increases the ocean of transcendental bliss by bringing more and more souls into it, and it helps us also to have a taste of the full nectar for which we are always anxious." Everyone is always anxious to enjoy fully, but he does not experience full enjoyment, because he's not linked with the source, which is Kṛṣṇa. The chanting forms an immediate link. And, erm, "It helps us to have a taste of the full nectar, for which we are always anxious." This is the verse. So this . . .		And the troubles with this material life, starting out with the cycle of birth and death, is likened to being in a blazing fire condition of existence. It says: "It is the life of all transcendental knowledge, this chanting." It brings it to life, the whole process. "It increases the ocean of transcendental bliss by bringing more and more souls into it, and it helps us also to have a taste of the full nectar for which we are always anxious." Everyone is always anxious to enjoy fully, but he does not experience full enjoyment, because he's not linked with the source, which is Kṛṣṇa. The chanting forms an immediate link. And, erm, "It helps us to have a taste of the full nectar, for which we are always anxious." This is the verse. So this . . .

RasaRasika: Text replacement - "Haṁsadūta:" to "'''Haṁsadūta:'''"

2023-09-08T01:10:39Z

Text replacement - "Haṁsadūta:" to "'''Haṁsadūta:'''"

RasaRasika: Text replacement - "Dhanañjaya:" to "'''Dhanañjaya:'''"

2023-09-08T01:07:12Z

Text replacement - "Dhanañjaya:" to "'''Dhanañjaya:'''"

RasaRasika: Text replacement - "Guest:" to "'''Guest:'''"

2023-09-08T00:48:25Z

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RasaRasika: Text replacement - "Prabhupāda:" to "'''Prabhupāda:'''"

2023-09-08T00:44:15Z

Text replacement - "Prabhupāda:" to "'''Prabhupāda:'''"

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RasaRasika: Text replacement - "Devotee:" to "'''Devotee:'''"

2023-09-08T00:40:49Z

Text replacement - "Devotee:" to "'''Devotee:'''"

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:40, 8 September 2023
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	Prabhupāda: Where is the intelligent people? They do not understand even what is virtue and sin. They do not understand. So where is the intelligent person? They are thinking everything is all right, but the nature does not say so. Nature says, "This is good for you. This is bad for you," but they do not know it. Where is Paṇḍita Mahāśaya (Pradyumna)? Call him.		Prabhupāda: Where is the intelligent people? They do not understand even what is virtue and sin. They do not understand. So where is the intelligent person? They are thinking everything is all right, but the nature does not say so. Nature says, "This is good for you. This is bad for you," but they do not know it. Where is Paṇḍita Mahāśaya (Pradyumna)? Call him.

	Devotee: He is in London.		'''Devotee:''' He is in London.

	Prabhupāda: Oh. Who can read ''Bhagavad-gītā''? Find out the verse ''pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca janā na vidur āsurāḥ janā'' ([[BG 16.7 (1972)\|BG 16.7]]).		Prabhupāda: Oh. Who can read ''Bhagavad-gītā''? Find out the verse ''pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca janā na vidur āsurāḥ janā'' ([[BG 16.7 (1972)\|BG 16.7]]).
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	Prabhupāda: Hmm. ''Pravṛtti. P-r-a-v-r-i-t-t-i''. In the Sixteenth Chapter.		Prabhupāda: Hmm. ''Pravṛtti. P-r-a-v-r-i-t-t-i''. In the Sixteenth Chapter.

	Devotee:		'''Devotee:'''

	:''pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca''		:''pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca''
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	Prabhupāda: They do not know what is to be done and what is not to be done. Next?		Prabhupāda: They do not know what is to be done and what is not to be done. Next?

	Devotee: "Neither cleanliness nor proper behavior . . ."		'''Devotee:''' "Neither cleanliness nor proper behavior . . ."

	Prabhupāda: No cleanliness, no proper behavior.		Prabhupāda: No cleanliness, no proper behavior.

	Devotee: ". . . nor truth is found in them."		'''Devotee:''' ". . . nor truth is found in them."

	Prabhupāda: This is the general division, fourth-class, fifth-class men—demonic. Then?		Prabhupāda: This is the general division, fourth-class, fifth-class men—demonic. Then?

	Devotee: Purport?		'''Devotee:''' Purport?

	Prabhupāda: Hmm.		Prabhupāda: Hmm.

	Devotee: "In every civilized human society there is some set of scriptural rules and regulations which are followed from the beginning, especially among the Āryans, those who adopt the Vedic civilization and who are known as the most advanced civilized peoples."		'''Devotee:''' "In every civilized human society there is some set of scriptural rules and regulations which are followed from the beginning, especially among the Āryans, those who adopt the Vedic civilization and who are known as the most advanced civilized peoples."

	Prabhupāda: In the civilized men, there is such thing: do and do not. Even in ordinary dealing: "Keep to the right" or "Keep to the left," that means the other side you do not go, ordinary. So why there must be discipline, law and order? There must be these two things: do this; do not do this. Otherwise it is not civilized. Now in the Christian Bible, Lord Jesus Christ says, "Thou shall not kill." But they are killing, giving some plea. Straight thing is, the order is, "Thou shall not kill." But they are killing in spite of. In ordinarily, one does not know whether killing is good or bad. But even there is instruction—"Don't kill"—they do it.		Prabhupāda: In the civilized men, there is such thing: do and do not. Even in ordinary dealing: "Keep to the right" or "Keep to the left," that means the other side you do not go, ordinary. So why there must be discipline, law and order? There must be these two things: do this; do not do this. Otherwise it is not civilized. Now in the Christian Bible, Lord Jesus Christ says, "Thou shall not kill." But they are killing, giving some plea. Straight thing is, the order is, "Thou shall not kill." But they are killing in spite of. In ordinarily, one does not know whether killing is good or bad. But even there is instruction—"Don't kill"—they do it.
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	Prabhupāda: No. That is you might have seen only the original verses. Here there is explanation.		Prabhupāda: No. That is you might have seen only the original verses. Here there is explanation.

	Devotee: The original verses are here. And there is full purport.		'''Devotee:''' The original verses are here. And there is full purport.

	Guest: I see. Yeah. I once, in fact, was at a course on the ''Gītā''. I went to a course on it. But that was many years ago, when I was very young, so I have forgotten now. I used to be in the Theosophical Movement, which has some relation . . . some related ideas, because its origin is in Indian philosophy. So I know little about the ''Gītā'', but.		Guest: I see. Yeah. I once, in fact, was at a course on the ''Gītā''. I went to a course on it. But that was many years ago, when I was very young, so I have forgotten now. I used to be in the Theosophical Movement, which has some relation . . . some related ideas, because its origin is in Indian philosophy. So I know little about the ''Gītā'', but.
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	Prabhupāda: Go on reading.		Prabhupāda: Go on reading.

	Devotee: "Those who do not follow the scriptural injunctions are supposed to be demons. Therefore it is stated here that the demons do not know the scriptural rules, nor do they have any inclination to follow them. Most of them do not know them, and even if some of them know, they have not the tendency to follow them."		'''Devotee:''' "Those who do not follow the scriptural injunctions are supposed to be demons. Therefore it is stated here that the demons do not know the scriptural rules, nor do they have any inclination to follow them. Most of them do not know them, and even if some of them know, they have not the tendency to follow them."

	Prabhupāda: Yes. These are demons. If you are professing some religion, and the religion says that, "You do not do this," if you act against the scripture, then you are demon. Just like if one does not act according to the law of the state, he is outlaw. But these things are not taken very seriously at the present moment.		Prabhupāda: Yes. These are demons. If you are professing some religion, and the religion says that, "You do not do this," if you act against the scripture, then you are demon. Just like if one does not act according to the law of the state, he is outlaw. But these things are not taken very seriously at the present moment.
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	Prabhupāda: That is not evolution. Evolution is different. That we have got full knowledge. Evolution means just like I am now living in a house. It will belonged to some lord. What is this lord?		Prabhupāda: That is not evolution. Evolution is different. That we have got full knowledge. Evolution means just like I am now living in a house. It will belonged to some lord. What is this lord?

	Devotee: Piggot.		'''Devotee:''' Piggot.

	Prabhupāda: Piggot. Lord Piggot. Now I am become lord. Piggot is gone. (laughter) Now it is Bhaktivedanta Manor. So not that I was in a small cottage, the cottage has evolved to become a big, palatial building. Not that. I have come from that cottage to this big house. That this nonsense Darwin does not know. Not elevation of the cottage to this big house. It is my personal elevation, that I was living in a cottage; now I have got the chance to live in a palatial house. I am concerned. But Darwin is thinking the cottage has evolved to become a big house. That is his nonsense.		Prabhupāda: Piggot. Lord Piggot. Now I am become lord. Piggot is gone. (laughter) Now it is Bhaktivedanta Manor. So not that I was in a small cottage, the cottage has evolved to become a big, palatial building. Not that. I have come from that cottage to this big house. That this nonsense Darwin does not know. Not elevation of the cottage to this big house. It is my personal elevation, that I was living in a cottage; now I have got the chance to live in a palatial house. I am concerned. But Darwin is thinking the cottage has evolved to become a big house. That is his nonsense.
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	Seventh Chapter. ''Bhūmi. B-h-u-m-i.''		Seventh Chapter. ''Bhūmi. B-h-u-m-i.''

	Devotee: ''Bhūmir āpo''?		'''Devotee:''' ''Bhūmir āpo''?

	:''bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ''		:''bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ''
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	Prabhupāda: ''Bhinnā prakṛtir me aṣṭadhā''. Yes.		Prabhupāda: ''Bhinnā prakṛtir me aṣṭadhā''. Yes.

	Devotee: "Earth, water, fire, air, ether, mind, intelligence and false ego—all together these eight comprise My separated material energies."		'''Devotee:''' "Earth, water, fire, air, ether, mind, intelligence and false ego—all together these eight comprise My separated material energies."

	Prabhupāda: Yes. This is the whole composition of the whole material world, these eight elements: earth, water, fire, air, sky—this is gross; and mind, intelligence, ego—subtle. So the whole material . . . whole cosmic manifestation is combination of these eight things. Just like the same analogy: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9.		Prabhupāda: Yes. This is the whole composition of the whole material world, these eight elements: earth, water, fire, air, sky—this is gross; and mind, intelligence, ego—subtle. So the whole material . . . whole cosmic manifestation is combination of these eight things. Just like the same analogy: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9.

RasaRasika at 04:07, 23 May 2020

2020-05-23T04:07:23Z

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Acyuta: 1 revision(s)

2008-04-21T16:25:24Z

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Śrīla Prabhupāda: But death is compelling me to die. There is no science, no philosophy, no hero to conquer over this death. This is our philosophy: how to conquer over the race between life and death. Now you find out that verse,

<PS:"Verse in purp">janma karma ca me divyam<CR>evaṁ yo vetti tattvataḥ<CR>tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma<CR>naiti mām eti so 'rjuna<CR> [[BG 4.9]]

This is Sanskrit language.

Śyāmasundara: "One who knows the transcendental nature of My appearance and activities does not upon leaving the body take his birth again in this material world."

Prabhupāda: "Does not take his birth again."

Śyāmasundara: "But attains My eternal abode."

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is the winning over death. What is that process?

Śyāmasundara: Ah, "One who knows the transcendental nature of My appearance and activities."

Prabhupāda: Simply if you know what is Kṛṣṇa, why He comes, what are His activities. These things, if you try to understand, then you conquer over death.

Graham Hill: And anyone who, I mean, you know the (indictinct) and you are telling your followers.

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is our philosophy. We are spreading this philosophy. That conquer over death and go back to home, back to Godhead. Therefore our name of the paper is Back to Godhead. Winning over the race between life and death and get your eternal life and go back to home, back to Godhead. This is our philosophy.

Graham Hill: You believe then, in that we come back, rebirth again in another form.

Prabhupāda: Yes, transmigration. Just like you also were a boy like him, but where is that body? There is no... That body, that is finished. But you exist, you remember that you were a boy like him. You remember that boy's childhood body. So that body is finished but you are not finished. So therefore you, the soul, is eternal. You are simply changing body. This is called death. Death means changing the body. As soon as the body becomes old enough, no more youthful, then you die. Die means to change the body just like you change your garment. When the garment is no more useful, then you change to another garment. That is truth. vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya [[BG 2.22]] . (aside:) You come here. Just like jīrṇāni , when old garment, no more youthful, you change it to a new garment. (aside:) Come here, find out vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya .

Pradyumna:

<PS:"Verse in purp"><FC:0,0,0>vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya <PT:14><CR> <PT><FC> navāni gṛhṇāti naro 'parāṇi<CR>tathā śarīrāṇi vihāya jīrṇāny<CR> anyāni saṁyāti navāni dehī<CR> [[BG 2.22]]

"As a person puts on new garments, giving up old ones, similarly, the soul accepts new material bodies, giving up the old and useless ones."

Graham Hill: And you go back to Godhead, you go back to home.

Prabhupāda: That is ultimate goal. So long we do not go back to home, back to Godhead, we have to, in our material existence, we have to change from one body to another. That is going on. And there are 8,400,000 forms of bodies. The cats and dogs, they are also living entities, but they have got a different type of body. Every one of us, different type body. Even they are children, their body is different from your body. Even the (indistinct). Although their body is obtained, there are some similarities. But if you analyze very scrutinizingly there will be some difference from your body, from your daughter's body, from your boy's body. So every body, every living entity is getting a certain type of body according to his desire. According to his desire. So that desire means material enjoyment. Just like you have got certain desire to become champion in racing. Another body has got desire to become something else. Another body has got desire for something else. So we have got this freedom by the grace of God or Kṛṣṇa. Because we are children. He has given freedom. "All right, if you want this, take it." In this way our life is going on. This is called birth and death. One chapter you are finishing in one life, next chapter begins another life. Next chapter begins another life. So the problem is birth and death. But nobody wants birth and death. Nobody wants. But it is there on account of our material life. So in material life there are four problems: birth, death, old age, and disease. So long one has to accept a material body, he has to accept these miseries also. Birth is also misery. When the child remains within the womb, in a compact bag... Very precarious condition. We have forgotten, but it is very precarious condition. And for ten months, because he is unconscious at least for seven months he cannot understand. But after seven months when the child becomes conscious, it is very intolerable. He always prays, "Oh, how to get out, how to get out." Then he gets, come out, comes out. Then another life begins. That is also accompanied with so many miserable conditions from the birth. Just like, don't mind, when you drive your car, it is not a very good position. (laughter) Yes. But you are taking that risk for winning over. But the position is not very good. At any moment there can be accident. So similarly, we are trying to achieve some goal of life, every one of us—there are so many varieties of living entities—with the risk of life and death, old age and disease. But if we know what is our actual aim of life... The actual aim of life should be back to home, back to Godhead. Then this human form of life is successful. Just like your son. If he goes out independent. Now he is under father's protection, he is very happy. But if he declares his independence... Just like Śyāmasundara. He is very rich man's son. His father, I met him. His father is a big lawyer, big businessman. But he declared independence. And I know his life history, how much he had to go through so many tribulations. Similarly, we are also sons of God. We have declared independence and we are going through so many chapters of life and death in different... Now we have got... Suppose you have got now a nice Englishman's body but next body you do not know what kind of body you are going to get. That will depend on your karma and desire.

Graham Hill: (indistinct) what sort of body we have been in in the past?

Prabhupāda: Yes, in the past. You forgot, but in the past you had life. Just like in the past I was young man. That's a fact. Similarly, but that young body is no more existing. Similarly, I had a past life but I have forgotten. That is the... Forgetfulness is our nature. Death means forgetting what was your first, past life. That is by nature you become forgetful because if you remember our past life and compare with this life... Suppose one was very rich man and if he becomes a poor, a cat and dog, then if he remembers, then it is very unbearable for him. Therefore nature helps him to forget. Forget. Otherwise he cannot do it. But the real problem is that we are eternal soul, we are changing our body one after another, birth and death. Apart from worldly happiness and distress, this birth and death, that is not very good process. At death time we have to suffer so much that we give up this body. And then again we enter into the womb of a mother. That is not very good situation. Then when come out there are so many tribulations, disease, then again old age. So people do not understand that he is passing... Especially when we are in other than human life. There are 8,400,000 species of life. Aquatics, then birds, trees, plants, insects, then beasts. In this way we come to human form of life. This is evolution. So in this human form of life there is chance of understanding the problems of life. In other forms of life it is not possible.

Graham Hill: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is consciousness. Full consciousness. But if that consciousness is developed into Kṛṣṇa consciousness then his life is success.

Graham Hill: Can we look at ourselves and say, well, this body that we inherited, the bodies that we're in now, are the results of the behavior of our souls when we were in our previous...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Graham Hill: And then can we sort of, by looking at ourselves, can we get the sort of person we were when we were here before?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Graham Hill: Can we?

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is... There is... Even astrology, Bṛghu-saṁhitā . Astrological calculation. You can know your past life, present life, and future life. There is system. Bṛghu-saṁhitā .

Graham Hill: So by our behavior (indistinct) will determine what sort of body we will get when we return?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like if you are educating your son for future life. So according to his education, according to his qualification, his future life will be fixed up. If he is properly educated he can become a very big man. And if he is not, he may not become. So this life is preparation for the next life. So this human form of life, if we are advanced in our consciousness then we should try to get our next life going back to home, back to Godhead. This...

<LS:1><TS:0.5,NM,NO,1,NM,NO,1.5,NM,NO,2,NM,NO,2.5,NM,NO,3,NM,NO,3.5,NM,NO,4,NM,NO,4.5,NM,NO,5,NM,NO,5.5,NM,NO,6,NM,NO,6.5,NM,NO>

<PS:"Verse in purp">yānti deva-vratā devān<CR> pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ<CR>bhūtāni yānti bhūtejyā<CR>yānti mad-yājino 'pi mām<CR> [[BG 9.25]]

Find out this verse.

Śyāmasundara: There is no more body? No more body?

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, this body you have got. Just like this hat and coat, vasamsi, this is covering of your body. So you have got already your spiritual body.

Śyāmasundara: Spiritual body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is now covered by this material element. So emancipation or salvation means you no more get your material body. But your body is already there. Just like in this body, I have got my body. And because I have got a hand my dress has got a hand. Because I have got a leg, my pant has got a leg. So this superficial, external body is simply covering of your original body. The original body is spiritual. So go back to home back to Godhead means you remain in your original spiritual body. You get freedom from this covering of material body. Now that spiritual body you can transfer to so many ways. Read it.

Pradyumna:

<PS:"Verse in purp">yānti deva-vratā devān<CR> pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ<CR>bhūtāni yānti bhūtejyā<CR> yānti mad-yājino 'pi mām. <CR> [[BG 9.25]]

"Those who worship the demigods will take birth amongst the demigods."

Prabhupāda: Higher planetary system of demigods, yes.

Pradyumna: "Those who worship ghosts and spirits will take birth amongst such beings. Those who worship ancestors go to the ancestors. And those who worship Me will live with Me."

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we can transfer to any form of body. Simply you have to prepare. But if we remain in our original body then you go back to home, back to Godhead.

Graham Hill: How do we attain our spiritual body?

Prabhupāda: You have got already spiritual body.

Graham Hill: I mean, how did I get my spiritual body?

Prabhupāda: Because you are part and parcel of God. God is all spirit. Just like materially, because you have got white body your son has got white body. Similarly, God is all spirit. Therefore you are son of God, part and parcel of God, then you are all spirit. But you have got this material covering because you wanted to come here and enjoy or lord it over the material nature. Everyone is trying to that. Everyone is trying to become a very prominent man in this material world. That is he can lord it over the material nature. So because you desire to lord it over the material nature you have to accept a material body.

Graham Hill: Are all spiritual bodies the same? I mean, is your spiritual body exactly the same as...

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Spiritually you are all the same. Just like as human beings you are all the same but you may have a black dress, I may have a saffron dress, he may have white dress. This is outward covering. This is not myself. Similarly, dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā [[BG 2.13]] . Within this body the spirit soul is there and he is changing different types of bodies. So when he accepts a process, this going back to home, back to Godhead, to Kṛṣṇa, then he hasn't got to accept any more material body. He remains in his own spiritual body. And spiritual body by original constitution it is eternal. Eternal. Nityaṁ śāśvato 'yam, na hanyate hanyamāne [[BG 2.13]] . na jāyate mriyate vā kadācin . This is a description of it.

Śyāmasundara: In the spiritual bodies aren't there also individualities?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.

Śyāmasundara: My spiritual body won't be the same as...

Prabhupāda: Yes, just like father and son. Son is also individual. Father is also individual. Although the son is born of the body of the father, of the mother. But he is individual. He is individual. He can disobey father or he can obey the father. So long he obeys he is happy. When he disobeys he is unhappy. (to child) Is that all right? Eh? You want to be happy or unhappy? Obey your father, that's all. (laughter) Very simple philosophy. Yes.

Graham Hill: (indistinct) at home he is very active.

Prabhupāda: Yes, ...that's nice. Yes. So he sometimes becomes disobedient? Sometimes? Eh? Why? (laughs) That means you have got independence. Is it not? Yes. That means he has got independence. Yes. This is a fact. Similarly we are sons of God, we have got little independence. We may remain with God, we may give up His company and come here to find our own fortune. And to find our own fortune we are becoming implicated and taking birth in different species of life. That is our ignorance. You are obedient to your mother?

Girl: Sometimes.

Prabhupāda: Sometimes, not always.

Girl: Yes.

Prabhupāda: She is the youngest? Ah, therefore she must be disobedient. (laughter) Daughter is eldest? This daughter? Oh. You are obedient?

Girl: Sometimes.

Prabhupāda: Sometimes? Not always? (laughs) All right. Thank you.

Graham Hill: She's a bit wild when she is at home.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. So give them prasadam. Oh, (indistinct) that's nice. So I am very glad to see you with your all family. Ah. Please come here. We have got very... (end)

{{CV_Footer|{{PAGENAME}}}}

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:10, 8 September 2023
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	'''Guest:''' Why . . . how does that have such a strange effect?		'''Guest:''' Why . . . how does that have such a strange effect?

	Haṁsadūta: Why does it have such a strong effect, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa?		'''Haṁsadūta:''' Why does it have such a strong effect, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa?

	'''Dhanañjaya:''' "Strange."		'''Dhanañjaya:''' "Strange."
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	'''Guest:''' It is something very simple. And so then the world could be changed very nicely, and without any very complicated changes.		'''Guest:''' It is something very simple. And so then the world could be changed very nicely, and without any very complicated changes.

	Haṁsadūta: For example, the best example and most practical example is, for instance, George Harrison, whom you must know. He has given this house for our propagating Kṛṣṇa consciousness. He himself is singing about Kṛṣṇa. So he is a singer. Before he was singing something; now he is singing something. So it's simply a change to Kṛṣṇa. The singing is there, the music is there, the record is there, the audience is there—simply the consciousness or the object of the song is Kṛṣṇa. Just like you are a scientist, so you use your knowledge to systematically present Kṛṣṇa.		'''Haṁsadūta:''' For example, the best example and most practical example is, for instance, George Harrison, whom you must know. He has given this house for our propagating Kṛṣṇa consciousness. He himself is singing about Kṛṣṇa. So he is a singer. Before he was singing something; now he is singing something. So it's simply a change to Kṛṣṇa. The singing is there, the music is there, the record is there, the audience is there—simply the consciousness or the object of the song is Kṛṣṇa. Just like you are a scientist, so you use your knowledge to systematically present Kṛṣṇa.

	'''Guest:''' But there is a difference between presenting an idea which is about Kṛṣṇa and ideas, and . . .		'''Guest:''' But there is a difference between presenting an idea which is about Kṛṣṇa and ideas, and . . .
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	'''Guest:''' Yes. Well, some idea which is more complicated than just the word. I am surprised that just the chanting of the words will be so significant.		'''Guest:''' Yes. Well, some idea which is more complicated than just the word. I am surprised that just the chanting of the words will be so significant.

	Haṁsadūta: Because the philosophy or the understanding is that this sound ''Kṛṣṇa'', the sound of the name of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Kṛṣṇa, there is no difference. This is the meaning of absolute. Absolute means there is no difference between the name, the thing, its quality. In this world your name . . .		'''Haṁsadūta:''' Because the philosophy or the understanding is that this sound ''Kṛṣṇa'', the sound of the name of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Kṛṣṇa, there is no difference. This is the meaning of absolute. Absolute means there is no difference between the name, the thing, its quality. In this world your name . . .

	'''Prabhupāda:''' In this physical world, from the sound everything has come. From the sound, the air has come. From air, the fire has come. From fire, water has come. From water, earth has come.		'''Prabhupāda:''' In this physical world, from the sound everything has come. From the sound, the air has come. From air, the fire has come. From fire, water has come. From water, earth has come.
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' What is that?		'''Prabhupāda:''' What is that?

	Haṁsadūta: He says you are making it more silly than it actually is.		'''Haṁsadūta:''' He says you are making it more silly than it actually is.

	'''Prabhupāda:''' No.		'''Prabhupāda:''' No.
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' I do not think it is possible that you can change a black cow to a white cow. I don't think.		'''Prabhupāda:''' I do not think it is possible that you can change a black cow to a white cow. I don't think.

	Haṁsadūta: He is talking about breeding. He is talking about breeding.		'''Haṁsadūta:''' He is talking about breeding. He is talking about breeding.

	'''Prabhupāda:''' That is another process. That is another process. Not that the same black cow has become a white cow. That is not possible.		'''Prabhupāda:''' That is another process. That is another process. Not that the same black cow has become a white cow. That is not possible.
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	'''Guest:''' . . . because he supposed that . . . a monkey will change into a man, but in the same way as you can breed dogs, and things like that. You can obviously change their form. That happens occasionally even in nature, from some special ways that . . .		'''Guest:''' . . . because he supposed that . . . a monkey will change into a man, but in the same way as you can breed dogs, and things like that. You can obviously change their form. That happens occasionally even in nature, from some special ways that . . .

	Haṁsadūta: Yes. But a human being and a monkey . . . just like a cow and a horse. You will never get a horse from a cow, no matter how you breed them.		'''Haṁsadūta:''' Yes. But a human being and a monkey . . . just like a cow and a horse. You will never get a horse from a cow, no matter how you breed them.

	'''Guest:''' Well horse and cow, it's possible over many . . . a long time you can keep doing that.		'''Guest:''' Well horse and cow, it's possible over many . . . a long time you can keep doing that.

	Haṁsadūta: No.		'''Haṁsadūta:''' No.

	'''Guest:''' The horse and cow had a common ancestor.		'''Guest:''' The horse and cow had a common ancestor.

	Haṁsadūta: No. You must do it.		'''Haṁsadūta:''' No. You must do it.

	'''Prabhupāda:''' One thing is, even accepting his theory . . .		'''Prabhupāda:''' One thing is, even accepting his theory . . .
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' (to devotee) Just make him understand.		'''Prabhupāda:''' (to devotee) Just make him understand.

	Haṁsadūta: The point is that . . .		'''Haṁsadūta:''' The point is that . . .

	'''Guest:''' I can see what he is saying.		'''Guest:''' I can see what he is saying.

	Haṁsadūta: . . . whatever it is—animal or any species of life—it appears to change, but actually someone is changing it. It is not changing . . .		'''Haṁsadūta:''' . . . whatever it is—animal or any species of life—it appears to change, but actually someone is changing it. It is not changing . . .

	'''Guest:''' Yes. It's possible. I agree.		'''Guest:''' Yes. It's possible. I agree.

	Haṁsadūta: You understand?		'''Haṁsadūta:''' You understand?

	'''Guest:''' Yes. It's certainly possible that there is a force outside which is making things change.		'''Guest:''' Yes. It's certainly possible that there is a force outside which is making things change.
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' That he does not know.		'''Prabhupāda:''' That he does not know.

	Haṁsadūta: That is the defect in Darwin's theory. Darwin is putting forward that the matter is changing independently of any worker, of any other force.		'''Haṁsadūta:''' That is the defect in Darwin's theory. Darwin is putting forward that the matter is changing independently of any worker, of any other force.

	'''Prabhupāda:''' Therefore I say that is foolishness.		'''Prabhupāda:''' Therefore I say that is foolishness.
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	'''Guest:''' Yes. I agree. You could still have evolution, but it could be directed by an outside force.		'''Guest:''' Yes. I agree. You could still have evolution, but it could be directed by an outside force.

	Haṁsadūta: Yes. There is evolution, but there is it is spiritual, not material. In other words, the monkey body's not changing to the human form, but actually the soul . . . eh, what . . .		'''Haṁsadūta:''' Yes. There is evolution, but there is it is spiritual, not material. In other words, the monkey body's not changing to the human form, but actually the soul . . . eh, what . . .

	'''Prabhupāda:''' He is transmigrating . . .		'''Prabhupāda:''' He is transmigrating . . .

	Haṁsadūta: Transmigrates.		'''Haṁsadūta:''' Transmigrates.

	'''Prabhupāda:''' . . . from this body to another body.		'''Prabhupāda:''' . . . from this body to another body.

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:07, 8 September 2023
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' (aside) Just try to explain.		'''Prabhupāda:''' (aside) Just try to explain.

	Dhanañjaya: Yes, well, you can go on being a student. You can go on being a householder. You can go on being a professional man. You can do all these prescribed duties, and still you can go on becoming Kṛṣṇa conscious.		'''Dhanañjaya:''' Yes, well, you can go on being a student. You can go on being a householder. You can go on being a professional man. You can do all these prescribed duties, and still you can go on becoming Kṛṣṇa conscious.

	'''Guest:''' But there are degrees of it. So it's simple, but yet . . .		'''Guest:''' But there are degrees of it. So it's simple, but yet . . .

	Dhanañjaya: It's a practical application in daily life, day-to-day life.		'''Dhanañjaya:''' It's a practical application in daily life, day-to-day life.

	'''Guest:''' But then does that take a long time or a lot of training?		'''Guest:''' But then does that take a long time or a lot of training?

	Dhanañjaya: No. It doesn't take so much training.		'''Dhanañjaya:''' No. It doesn't take so much training.

	'''Guest:''' Then what is the purpose of degrees of initiation? That's if it's just a one thing . . .		'''Guest:''' Then what is the purpose of degrees of initiation? That's if it's just a one thing . . .

	Dhanañjaya: That's something different. If you want to take seriously, then you can become initiated.		'''Dhanañjaya:''' That's something different. If you want to take seriously, then you can become initiated.

	'''Guest:''' And what is the function of that?		'''Guest:''' And what is the function of that?

	Dhanañjaya: The function is that you accept the spiritual master as a bona fide representative as God, and then you take the rules and regulations very seriously, and you abide by these rules and regulations. There are rules and regulations in every ''āśrama'', in every temple. Just like for instance if you decided you would like to stay here, so you . . . it would be expected that you follow four basic rules: no meat-eating; no intoxication; no illicit sex life; and no idle sports, no gambling, no betting.		'''Dhanañjaya:''' The function is that you accept the spiritual master as a bona fide representative as God, and then you take the rules and regulations very seriously, and you abide by these rules and regulations. There are rules and regulations in every ''āśrama'', in every temple. Just like for instance if you decided you would like to stay here, so you . . . it would be expected that you follow four basic rules: no meat-eating; no intoxication; no illicit sex life; and no idle sports, no gambling, no betting.

	You see? And taking part in the day-to-day routine, like rising early, bathing, attending the services and helping to maintain the ''āśrama'' by working or by engaging in some particular duty that you would like to do—by writing. You can do this. If you have this vocation to write, then we supply you an office, we supply you with a typewriter, paper, and you can write so many nice articles about Kṛṣṇa. And therefore that . . . dovetailing whatever you have experienced in the material world and whatever you have understood from the ''śāstra'', from the scripture. You're benefiting yourself and you're benefiting your fellow men also.		You see? And taking part in the day-to-day routine, like rising early, bathing, attending the services and helping to maintain the ''āśrama'' by working or by engaging in some particular duty that you would like to do—by writing. You can do this. If you have this vocation to write, then we supply you an office, we supply you with a typewriter, paper, and you can write so many nice articles about Kṛṣṇa. And therefore that . . . dovetailing whatever you have experienced in the material world and whatever you have understood from the ''śāstra'', from the scripture. You're benefiting yourself and you're benefiting your fellow men also.
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	'''Guest:''' So that . . . that's the ''āśrama'' life. But even in the ordinary world, in a way which is what I'm interested in . . . I'm interested in the influence of Kṛṣṇa consciousness in the ordinary world, and how would it change people's relationships and how would it change . . .		'''Guest:''' So that . . . that's the ''āśrama'' life. But even in the ordinary world, in a way which is what I'm interested in . . . I'm interested in the influence of Kṛṣṇa consciousness in the ordinary world, and how would it change people's relationships and how would it change . . .

	Dhanañjaya: Well all we simply ask is to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, to spend a few minutes, sometime in the day—in the morning or in the evening—just to sit down and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and gradually take on these rules and regulations.		'''Dhanañjaya:''' Well all we simply ask is to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, to spend a few minutes, sometime in the day—in the morning or in the evening—just to sit down and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and gradually take on these rules and regulations.

	'''Prabhupāda:''' We actually say that chant Hare Kṛṣṇa always.		'''Prabhupāda:''' We actually say that chant Hare Kṛṣṇa always.
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	Haṁsadūta: Why does it have such a strong effect, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa?		Haṁsadūta: Why does it have such a strong effect, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa?

	Dhanañjaya: "Strange."		'''Dhanañjaya:''' "Strange."

	'''Prabhupāda:''' Oh, that you can see.		'''Prabhupāda:''' Oh, that you can see.
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' But Darwin's theory is like that. He is pointing out that this body has changed into this body.		'''Prabhupāda:''' But Darwin's theory is like that. He is pointing out that this body has changed into this body.

	Dhanañjaya: He says it has evolved from a monkey's form, with a tail, to a human being's form. But this is not according to this knowledge of ''Vedas''.		'''Dhanañjaya:''' He says it has evolved from a monkey's form, with a tail, to a human being's form. But this is not according to this knowledge of ''Vedas''.

	'''Guest:''' Well, you seem to be attributing the wrong theory to Darwin, that . . .		'''Guest:''' Well, you seem to be attributing the wrong theory to Darwin, that . . .
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	'''Prabhupāda:''' So if you can understand the Absolute Truth, the relative truths become automatically known. This is Vedic injunction. ''Yasmin vijñāte sarvam evaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavati'' (''Muṇḍaka Upaniṣad'' 1.1.3). By knowing the Absolute Truth . . . just like, take another example, analogy. In the mathematics 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 0. So if you simply learn this, then you learn the whole mathematics, because whatever you write in mathematics is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, in this way and that way, say plus, minus, division, but they are nothing but 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 . . . you simply make different angle of vision of studying, but the figures are the same—1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9.		'''Prabhupāda:''' So if you can understand the Absolute Truth, the relative truths become automatically known. This is Vedic injunction. ''Yasmin vijñāte sarvam evaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavati'' (''Muṇḍaka Upaniṣad'' 1.1.3). By knowing the Absolute Truth . . . just like, take another example, analogy. In the mathematics 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 0. So if you simply learn this, then you learn the whole mathematics, because whatever you write in mathematics is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, in this way and that way, say plus, minus, division, but they are nothing but 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 . . . you simply make different angle of vision of studying, but the figures are the same—1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9.

	Dhanañjaya: Everything else is simply a combination of . . .		'''Dhanañjaya:''' Everything else is simply a combination of . . .

	'''Prabhupāda:''' That's right.		'''Prabhupāda:''' That's right.