681115 - Lecture - Los Angeles

Lectures by Date, 1968

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

 Listen to a 'Nectar Drop' created from this lecture

681115LE-LOS ANGELES - November 15, 1968 - 86:21 Minutes

Prabhupāda: (kīrtana) (prema-dhvani) Thank you very much. (devotees offer obeisances)

Dayānanda: Prabhupāda? That was the realtor on the phone. He said he'll have the lease ready Monday.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that's all right.

Baby: Jaya.

Mother: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: Jaya. Jaya. Jaya. Very nice. The first vibration is jaya. (laughs)

(aside) Your article is out. You have seen it?

Upendra: No, I have not seen it. I heard that it is out.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Very nice article you have . . . you are feeling all right?

Upendra: Oh, yes.

Prabhupāda: Ānandamayo 'bhyāsāt (Vedānta-sūtra 1.1.12). This Kṛṣṇa consciousness is simply full of bliss. Nobody should become morose. If he's feeling morose, then it is lack of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This is the sign.

brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā

na śocati na kāṅkṣati

samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu

mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām

(BG 18.54)

Kṛṣṇa consciousness is a stage after liberation. Brahma-bhūtaḥ. Brahma-bhūtaḥ means "I am now free from all material anxieties." That is called brahma-bhūtaḥ stage. Just like a person suffering prison life for years together, and if he is given freedom, "Now you are free," how much delight he'll feel: "Oh, now I am free." You see?

So that is the stage of brahma-bhūtaḥ. Prasannātmā, joyful, immediately. And what is the nature of joyfulness? Na śocati. Even in the great loss, there is no lamentation. And big profit, there is no jubilation, or there is no hankering. That is called brahma-bhūtaḥ stage. Equipoised.

brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā

na śocati na kāṅkṣati

samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu

(BG 18.54)

In that stage one can see all living entities on the same understanding of spiritual identity. In another place Bhagavad-gītā says, paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). When a man is learned he sees everyone on the same level of spiritual understanding. So when one has reached this stage, then actually Kṛṣṇa consciousness begins. Mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām.

So Kṛṣṇa consciousness is so nice that it is activities of liberated stage. Everyone is trying to get liberation from these material pangs, every philosophy. Buddha philosophy, they are also trying—nirvāṇa. Nirvāṇa means extinguish this. So they want to make void. All these material varieties, they want to make it zero. That is Buddha philosophy.

Māyāvāda philosophy is more or less like that. It is a second edition of Buddha philosophy. Zero, but that zero is without life. Māyāvāda philosophy says: "Yes, that zero, but with life." That is the mistake. If there is life, then there must be varieties. Life without variety is not possible. Dead body without variety, not life without variety.

So these are the defects of all other philosophies. They're not defects, but the class of people amongst whom the philosophy was taught, they could not understand more than that. That's all. Just like a patient too much disturbed, he wants some medicine from the physician, "Please stop my disturbance. Kill me. Kill me."

Sometimes they say like that, "Give me some poison, kill me. I cannot tolerate." A physician says: "Yes, there is no need of killing. I shall give you good, healthy life." He's so much impatient, "No. I cannot tolerate. Please kill me." So this Buddha philosophy, Māyāvāda philosophy is like that, kill him. "Kill me, please. Make me zero, void." So much frustration. So much disturbance that they want to make it zero. But our philosophy is life, real life.

But it is difficult to understand this philosophy, Kṛṣṇa philosophy. Why it is difficult? That is explained, gṛha-vratānām. Gṛha-vratānām. Gṛha means "house." So vrata means "vow." Just like everyone, common man, anywhere, they are interested with these bodily comforts: nice apartment, nice country, nice state, confident, nice bank balance. These things are their aspiration; no more. Nothing more. First of all this body, gṛha. Gṛha means house, living place.

So I am the soul, I am living, and this body is my first living place. This is also gṛha. I am not this body. Just like I am living in this apartment, I am not this apartment. Similarly, I am living in this body, but I am not this body. This is the beginning of spiritual education. Unless one does not understand that "I am not this body; I am living in this body," there is no question of spiritual education. He does not know what is spiritual and material.

So this misunderstanding that, "I am this body. I belong to this apartment, I belong to this society, I belong to this country, I belong to this nation, I belong to this world, I belong to this universe"—you can expand—that is all misunderstanding. All misunderstanding. If you say: "Oh, now I am not . . ." Just like big leaders, they say that, "My life is for the nation."

And some ordinary common man says: "Oh, my life is for my family." And a less important person, just like childlike, he is or she is for this body. That's all. So this expansion from bodily concept of life to family life, or to . . . from family to community life, from community to society life or national life or universal brotherhood life—that is very much appreciated: "Oh, this man is after universal brotherhood"—these are all bogus. You see?

But this is a misconception. You can expand. However you may expand, the defect will be there. Just like the so-called nationalist or humanitarist or universalist, they are packed up within the boundary of the human being. They have no expansions toward other living entities. Their national conception, that the human body should be given protection but animal body no protection . . . why?

They are also nationals. But they have no such idea, because all these ideas are defective. There is shortcut. So only Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the perfect . . . so Bhāgavata says, na te viduḥ . . . matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā mitho 'bhipadyeta gṛha-vratānām (SB 7.5.30).

So actually gṛha means this material confinement. Gṛha, real gṛha, means one is bound up within some limited space. So gṛha means to keep oneself within some boundary. So Bhāgavata says so long one is interested to keep himself within the boundary of some limited area, he cannot understand Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Matir na kṛṣṇe. He cannot understand what is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness. He's limited within certain boundary.

So Bhāgavata says Kṛṣṇa consciousness is not possible for persons who are limited by certain boundary, including universal concept of life. That is also boundary. And matir na kṛṣṇe svataḥ. Svataḥ means by his personal mental speculation. Just like many philosophers are thinking to reach the Absolute Truth beyond this limitation. That is called svataḥ, by personal speculation.

Svataḥ, parataḥ. Parataḥ means from authorities. From spiritual master, from scriptures, from authoritative books, authoritative source of knowledge, that is called parataḥ. Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā mitho. Mitho means by great assembly. Just like the United Nation is trying to solve the problem for the last many years, twenty to twenty-five years, all the nations. This is called mithaḥ, assembly. Mithaḥ means assembly.

So why it is not possible? Because they are limited. Their real concept is that, "I am this body," "I am this nation," "I am this this," "I am this," "I am . . ." That's all. The basic principle is wrong. Therefore it is not possible to make a solution of the problems, either by personal speculation or by receiving knowledge. Just like our principle is to receive knowledge from the spiritual master. But if I keep myself within this boundary . . .

Suppose if somebody thinks that, "I am American," then naturally he'll be inclined, "Oh, why shall I be inclined to hear from a spiritual master who is Indian, is Hindu?" So he'll not be able to capture parataḥ. Similarly, if you go to the assembly like United Nation or Commonwealth Conference, like that, but if you keep yourself that, "I am this," "I am this," "I am this," there is no possibility; therefore they are failing.

The basic principle is wrong. Gṛha-vrata. The concept of life is wrong. Gṛha-vratānām. And why they want to be limited by this poor concept of life? This is called material existence. Adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisram (SB 7.5.30). This limited concept of life is due to unbridled sense. This limited concept of life they want to keep, because they want to satisfy their senses. I am going to the assembly, United Nation, but I am keeping myself as American or as German, as Russian or Indian that, "My nation shall be happy in this way." Indian is thinking in that way, American is thinking that way, Russian is thinking in another way, another way.

They are keeping themself in that limited area, and what benefit they will derive simply by wasting time in the assembly and talking? This is called gṛha-vratānām. So one has to go outside this limited area. That is called brahma-bhūtaḥ stage. Then they'll have real Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Matir na kṛṣṇe parato svato.

So why I want that I shall be happy in this way? I make my own plan, "My nation will be happy in this way." This is called saṁsāra, adānta-gobhir, because I want to satisfy my senses. Adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisram. And the position is punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). Punaḥ punaś carvita-car . . . carvita-carvaṇa means chewing the chewed.

Something is chewed and thrown away in the street, and if somebody comes and chews again that thrown away article, he cannot get any juice out of it. Similarly, we are making plan, but because it is on the platform of sense gratification, the whole thing is coming to the four principles of animal life—eating, sleeping, mating, defending. That's all. That means in a circle, coming to the same animal platform.

The distinction between animal and man is that . . . man and animal, they have got common platform of these four principles of life: eating, sleeping, mating and defending. The only extra qualification of man is that he can come to understand what is Kṛṣṇa and what is God. That is his special qualification. But because they are trying to keep themselves within the limit of sense gratification, they're coming again and again to that same platform, eating, sleeping, mating and defending, without Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

So this is the secret how to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. We should not limit ourself under certain area. And how it is possible? That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that "I am eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa, or God." That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So if we keep ourself within some limit, then it will be not possible to understand what is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā mitho 'bhipadyeta gṛha . . . these are verses . . . Bhāgavata verses can be explained for so many days. They are so important. Yes.

The another verse is that why they are keeping themself within the limit of this sense gratificatory platform. That is answered in Bhāgavata:

na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ

durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ

(SB 7.5.31)

This is very important. These foolish persons, they do not know what is the ultimate goal of their life. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum. They do not know that their self-interest . . . everyone is self-interest. Everyone is eager to look after his self-interest, but they do not know what is the self-interest. Durāśayā.

Because they do not know, therefore, out of ulterior motive, they are thinking that, "Satisfaction in the material way of life will give me ultimate pleasure or ultimate satisfaction. That is my ultimate goal." Therefore the scientist, the politician, everyone is trying, making their own plan. And what is that plan? By manipulating this external energy, dura . . . bahir-artha, bahir-artha-māninaḥ.

Now, we are preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness. People are not interested in this thing. Had I been an expert in certain technology, electronics, improvement in electronics, then thousands of students and people would come and hear me. Bahir-artha-māninaḥ. Because a person is dealing with the ingredients of the external energy, people are thinking, "This technological knowledge will give me happiness."

Durāśayā. That is durāśayā. That is useless hope. Bhāgavata says this kind of hope, that this kind of material advancement, this kind of material adjustment . . . after all, it is material. That will not give you happiness. But they are thinking like that.

They are hoping like that. Durāśayā. Durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās (SB 7.5.31). Andhā. This means that we are blind, we do not know what is the goal of our life.

(aside) Stop.

We do not know what is the goal of our life, and the leaders, they also do not know what is the goal of our life. Our Back to Godhead editorial, they have written very nicely that with the change of some politician we are thinking that something new will be done and we shall be happy. Just like there is advertisement, "America Needs Nixon Now." (laughter) People are thinking, "Now, instead of Johnson, when Mr. Nixon will be president, we shall be happy."

But they do not know from which stock either this Mr. Johnson or Nixon is coming. The source of supply is the same. If the source of supply is the same, then what is there, replacing Mr. Johnson by Nixon or by Nixon by Johnson? The leader themselves, they are blind. They do not know what is the ultimate goal of life.

Therefore our position is that we are blind and our leaders are blind, so what will be the result? If a blind man leads other hundreds men . . . hundred men to cross over the street, certainly there will be some accident, because all of them are blind men. If one man is with eyes, open eyes, he can lead hundreds and thousands of men behind him. But if the leader and the led, both of them are blind, then the result will be that all of them will fall into the ditch.

So, andhā yathāndair upanīyamānā te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ. They're promising, "My dear citizens, my dear countrymen, if you give me vote, because the country needs me at the present moment, then I shall give you all comforts, all solution." But he is īśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ. By the laws of God, by the laws of nature, he is tightly packed up. You see? If your hands are tightly knotted, if your legs are tightly, then how you can work?

So these leaders, they do not know that they are under the control of the stringent laws of nature. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). Suppose if there is a heavy earthquake. Suppose the Atlantic Ocean . . . and there is some suggestion like that, some years they will mix together, by the scientist. Suppose the Atlantic Ocean and Pacific Ocean mix together. Then how you can check? Your hands and legs are tightly packed up. You cannot check the laws of nature.

Therefore blind leaders who are so tightly packed up by the laws of nature, how they can lead? They cannot lead. They cannot lead to the goal of life. The goal of life is God, or Kṛṣṇa, but they are enamored by the glimmering of . . . glittering of this material nature. So they cannot lead.

Then how . . . what is the solution? If Kṛṣṇa consciousness is not possible to cultivate by speculation, by assembly meeting, or by knowledge derived from higher authoritative sources, the leaders are misleading, then how it is to be attained? How the goal of life can be attained? Then that is suggested by Prahlāda Mahārāja: naiṣāṁ matis tāvad urukramāṅghrim (SB 7.5.32).

One cannot become Kṛṣṇa consciousness . . . one cannot become Kṛṣṇa conscious, naiṣāṁ matis tāvad urukramāṅghrim anartha . . . anarthāpagamo yad-arthaḥ. Spṛśaty anarthāpagamo yad-arthaḥ. As soon as one becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious or one becomes in touch with Kṛṣṇa consciousness, spṛśaty, anartha, immediately he becomes delivered from all these misgivings of material existence. That is the test. How one is in contact with Kṛṣṇa consciousness will be tested—how he is freed from all misgivings.

Just like for example—not very gigantic example—very small—our students, as soon as they take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, initiated, immediately so many misgivings they give up. So many. The basic principles of misgiving, what is that? No illicit sex, no intoxication, no meat-eating, no gambling. It is very difficult for persons, especially in the Western countries, to give up all these habits. They are so much entangled.

Even Lord Ronaldsay, Marquis of Zetland . . . one of my Godbrother, some years ago, in 1935 he went to London, and Lord Zetland, Marquis of Zetland, Lord Ronaldsay . . . he was a Scotsman. I don't think whether he is living, but he was very interested in Indian philosophy. He was once governor of Bengal. In our childhood we saw him. He came to our college.

So he inquired from this preacher, my Godbrother, that Bannerji, he was Mr. Bannerji, Goswami Bannerji, "Bannerji, can you make us brahmin?" Bannerji said: "Why not? Yes, we can make you brahmin. Then you have to follow the rules, these four principles of rules. Then you can become a brahmin." He said: "Oh, it is impossible." He said. You see? Such a big personality, he is interested in philosophy, he holds some position, responsible man, he flatly denied, "Oh, it is not possible to give up these habits."

But our student, hundreds of students who are coming to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they are giving up very easily. They don't feel any inconvenience. This is spṛśaty anarthāpagamo yad-arthaḥ. Kṛṣṇa consciousness, the first test is that in the beginning, from the very beginning, all misgivings will go on. Will go on.

Our student can twenty-four hours sit down before a Deity and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Bring any student of any yoga society, let him sit down for five hours, he'll fail. They are so restless. Simply official fifteen minutes, half an hour, by closing the eyes and murmuring something, meditation. These boys are twenty-four hours engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

So Kṛṣṇa consciousness is so nice. That is the test. All these boys, any man can come and ask them how they are feeling. Unless they feel some spiritual satisfaction, how they can give up everything and be engaged in this Kṛṣṇa conscious chanting? Therefore this is the test. Naiṣāṁ matis tāvad urukramāṅghrim. Matis tāvad. Matis tāvad urukramāṅghrim. Urukramāṅghrim.

Urukrama. Kṛṣṇa's another name is Urukrama. Urukrama means . . . uru means very difficult, and krama means steps. Just like Kṛṣṇa in the Vāmana avatāra, He forwarded His steps up to the sky. His name is therefore Urukrama.

So one cannot fix up his mind on the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa unless mahīyasāṁ pāda-rajo-'bhiṣekaṁ niṣkiṣcanānāṁ na vṛṇīta yāvat. This is not possible so long he has not the opportunity of touching the dust of the lotus feet of a personality who is niṣkiṣcana, who has no material hankerings, mahīyasām, and life is dedicated only for Kṛṣṇa. As soon as one comes in touch with such personality, by his grace, this thing, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness, can be achieved. Not by any other method. Naiṣāṁ matis tāvad urukramāṅghrim (SB 7.5.32).

The test will be spṛśaty anarthāpagamo yad-arthaḥ mahīyasāṁ pādo-rajo-'bhiṣekaṁ niṣkiṣcanānāṁ na vṛṇīta yāvat. This is the test, and this is the way to approach a bona fide person and receive this Kṛṣṇa consciousness from him, by his mercy, by his grace. But as soon as one receives, immediately his liberation from material entanglement begins. Immediately, immediately. And then as he makes further progress, progress, progress, his life becomes sublime.

Now one thing . . . one may question, suppose one has taken up to Kṛṣṇa consciousness out of sentiment, but he could not finish it. What is the result? That is also said in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam: tyaktvā sva-dharmaṁ caraṇāmbujaṁ harer (SB 1.5.17). Sva-dharmam. Sva-dharma means everyone has got some specific duty, occupation. Everyone. So if somebody gives up his specific duty in which he's engaged, tyaktvā sva-dharmam . . . just like many boys and girls, they come here. They were engaged in something else, but all of a sudden they give up and they join this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. So for them, Bhāgavata says, tyaktvā sva-dharmam . . . sva means his own occupation, dharma.

Now here the dharma is not religion. Occupational duty. Tyaktvā sva-dharmaṁ caraṇāmbujaṁ harer. Suppose after hearing some lectures of this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, he settles, "Now I shall begin Kṛṣṇa consciousness," and gives up his prescribed duties or occupational duty.

tyaktvā sva-dharmaṁ caraṇāmbujaṁ harer

bhajann apakvo 'tha patet tato yadi

(SB 1.5.17)

Bhajann. Now he begins chanting or regulative principles, but all of a sudden, he falls down. He falls down, he could not prosecute. By some reason or by some circumstances, he falls down.

So Bhāgavata says: "What is the wrong with him even if he falls down?" Just see. Even if he falls down due to immature development of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, still, he's not loser. And Bhāgavata says, ko vārtha āpto 'bhajatāṁ sva-dharmataḥ (SB 1.5.17). And what profit will he get, one who is very steadily engaged in his occupational duty? He's simply a loser, because he does not know what is the aim of his life.

But here, a person who comes in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, even for a few days if he is with us, he gets the contamination of Kṛṣṇa consciousness so that in his next life he'll begin again, again, again. So he's not loser. One injection of Kṛṣṇa consciousness will make him some day perfect in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, and he's sure to go back to Godhead, back to home.

So try to spread this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. And this is your sādhana, execution of austerity, penance. Because you have to meet so many opposing elements. You have to fight with them. That is tapasya. You are tolerating so much insults, so much botheration, and so much inconveniences, personal discomfort, everything sacrificed, money—but it will not go in vain. Rest assured. It will not go in vain. Kṛṣṇa will, I mean to say, reward you sufficiently. You go on executing this Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Thank you very much.

Devotees: Jaya. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Haribol. (offer obeisances)

Prabhupāda: So any question?

Madhudviṣa: Prabhupāda, could you tell us something about Kṛṣṇa's rāsa-līlā?

(pause)

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa's rāsa-līlā should not be discussed in public meeting. It is most confidential. Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu never discussed. He discussed Kṛṣṇa's pastimes, līlā with gopīs, with His confidential . . . very confidential circle. Or those who are . . . Lord Caitanya had many thousands of followers, and . . .

He was not discussing even within these five persons, śrī-kṛṣṇa-caitanya prabhu-nityānanda śrī-advaita gadādhara śrīvāsadi, Nityānanda, Advaita, Gadādhara, Śrīvāsa and Himself, these five persons. So when He was at Navadvīpa, He was not discussing even with them, what to speak of others. He set up this example so that in future people may be very cautious. Because unless one understands what is Kṛṣṇa, how he can understand Kṛṣṇa's pastime?

So this discussion of rāsa-līlā is the summit of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It is not ordinary thing. They're purely spiritual. There is nothing material. But because we are not completely free from material concept of life, we may think that Kṛṣṇa's līlā is something like this material. So that is offense. But that is the ultimate goal, to understand Kṛṣṇa's rāsa-līlā.

But you have to wait for relishing that Kṛṣṇa's rasa-līlā, to become more perfect in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Anarthāpagamam. Anartha means when one is freed from all anarthas. But it is so nice, even those who are with anartha, misgivings, if they are devotee, if they have got full surrender unto Kṛṣṇa, so they also will derive benefit.

Kṛṣṇa's rāsa-līlā means that Kṛṣṇa was adopted, or foster child. Is that foster child? Yes. So, of Nanda Mahārāja. His father exchanged. His father, Vasudeva, wanted to save Kṛṣṇa, and he brought from Mathurā to Vṛndāvana, Gokula. And Nanda Mahārāja had a daughter. So he placed Kṛṣṇa on the lap of Yaśodā and took away the daughter, and this daughter was given to Kaṁsa for killing. Just see, there is selfishness. He wanted to save his own son and wanted to kill Yaśodā's daughter. (chuckling) You see?

So this is not selfishness; therefore we shall misunderstand. That daughter was not ordinary child; she was the material energy herself, Durgā. So when Kaṁsa took that child by the leg and wanted to . . . what is called? Slash? Smash, yes . . . smash on the stone, the daughter slipped from his hand and appeared as Durgā that, "You fool, you want to kill me. The boy, the child who will kill you, is already born. Don't try for killing me. He's already born."

So Kṛṣṇa, up to sixteen years, He was in Vṛndāvana. Naturally, there were many children, boys and girls, they played together. So they were very . . . Kṛṣṇa, everyone loved. Vṛndāvana means simply center figure is Kṛṣṇa, and everyone loves. So some of the girls, they loved Kṛṣṇa, and a girl's loving means she wants Kṛṣṇa as husband.

But according to Vedic concept, the girls are married at the age of twelve to sixteen years, and boys are married from twenty to twenty-five years. So all the girls were married mostly, but Kṛṣṇa was not married. And some of the girls were not married, but all the girls, they were very fond of Kṛṣṇa. So from the childhood they were friends. So Kṛṣṇa used to play His flute, and all the girls would come.

So this rāsa-līlā was performed on this day, the Kṛṣṇa, in the full moon night, He played the flute, and the girls assembled and there was dance. There is similar dance, just like ball dance in your country. But the specific significance of this dance was that Kṛṣṇa bifurcated Himself in so many boys as many girls there were, and they began to dance in pair. That is sum and substance of rāsa-līlā.

So if you go to Vṛndāvana and if you like to dance with Kṛṣṇa, the facility is for you. That is the ultimate goal of our life. If you want to love Kṛṣṇa similarly as the gopīs loved, you can have the chance. Or if you want to love Kṛṣṇa as His cowherds boyfriend, that chance is also there. If you want to love Kṛṣṇa as child, that chance is also there. Any capacity you try to love Kṛṣṇa . . . Kṛṣṇa is ye yathā māṁ prapadyante (BG 4.11). "Anyone who worships Me or loves Me in any way, I am prepared to answer." He can answer . . . just like Nṛsiṁha-deva. Because Hiraṇyakaśipu wanted to love Kṛṣṇa by becoming enemy, so He also answered as enemy.

So there are twelve kinds of reciprocal exchange—seven secondary and five primary. So all these rāsas . . . rāsa means rāsa. Rāsa means humor. All these humors are present even in this material world in different way, as perverted reflection of the spiritual rasa. Nothing can be new here, but here it is a reflection only. Reality is there. So the five primary principles of loving affairs is there in the Vaikuṇṭha world.

And Kṛṣṇa consciousness means to practice Kṛṣṇa consciousness while we are in this material body, and after giving up this body, we enter into the spiritual realm for factually participating with Kṛṣṇa. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. So if you want to enter into the rāsa-līlā, if you desire like that, so you love Kṛṣṇa in that way, as the gopīs. Then you'll have the same perfection. There is no difficulty. It is not at all difficult. Simply you practice.

But you have to forget the rāsa-līlā of this material world. (chuckling) Otherwise there is no chance. If you want to imitate that rāsa-līlā in material world, then you play havoc. That risk is there. Yes. "Kṛṣṇa enjoyed with so many girls, so let me also become Kṛṣṇa and enjoy." Ah that is finished everything. (laughter)

(pause)Oh, she is appreciating. (chuckles)

Yes. Thank you. Come on. Reach.

So we'll have kīrtana or this record, or we'll close our meeting?

Dayānanda: Maybe we should have just the recording.

Prabhupāda: All right. You play that record. So on Monday they'll give possession?

Dayānanda: I think so. I don't know. Monday we sign the lease. And one of the options was that we could get possession upon signing the lease. As long as that option goes through . . .

Prabhupāda: the le . . . (break)

Govinda dāsī: Everybody wants kīrtana.

Dayānanda: Can it be just sort of a quiet kīrtana, since it's getting a little later?

Prabhupāda: Quiet kīrtana? (laughter) (laughs) Kīrtana means loud. (laughter) You make it quiet, please. This. Have you got that tape?

Govinda dāsī: Yes, I have it, but I have to rewind this one and then rewind the other one, which will take five minutes.

Prabhupāda: Oh, no, no. Then let us have . . . where is mine? So you play quietly.

(kīrtana, Govinda jaya jaya) (prema-dhvanī) Thank you very much. (devotees offer obeisances)

Devotees: (japa)

Prabhupāda: What about your siṁhāsana, throne?

Vāmanadeva: It's coming. It's coming. I'm building a small one out of balsawood to show you . . .

Prabhupāda: All right.

Vāmanadeva: . . . to see if I got the proportions right.

Prabhupāda: Your picture? So you lost some money there?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Ah . . . ah . . . (chuckles)

Prabhupāda: How is that?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Ah, yes. We didn't lose any, but we didn't make any money, Prabhupāda. He charged us for the half a month we had lived there. But I'm still going to tell him that if he doesn't give us more money, I'll call the housing authority.

And we have a letter written to the housing authority, and we'll read it to him and tell him that if he doesn't gives us more money, we are posting this letter immediately. He is a rascal. (break) (end)