710815 - Conversation - London

Conversations by Date, 1971

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

710815rc.lon - August 15, 1971

Prabhupāda: Simply we shall sell retail in our saṅkīrtana. Let them sell to the bookstore. We shall not sell a single copy to the bookstore, or wholesaler. We shall simply sell in our saṅkīrtana party. In this way arrange . . . (break)

Śyāmasundara: . . . weekend festivals from town to town?

Prabhupāda: Town to town. What do you think this idea Huh? Continue engagement. And as many men may join us, we can accommodate them. Every country. Yajñaiḥ saṅkīrtana prāyair yajanti hi sumedhasaḥ (SB 11.5.32). I got this idea, one king . . . (indistinct) . . . the grandson of Prthuraya, this Mahārāja Prithu, he performed so many yajñas that on the surface of the earth, there were only kuśa grass scattered. Yajña, they require kuśa grass. Kuśa grass. So all over the world it was simply scattered, after yajñas, I have given my comment in this. Similarly, we shall perform this saṅkīrtana yajña all over the world, town to town, town to town. Now we have got GBC all over the world. Let them organize. What they'll do? Organize yajña after yajña, yajña after yajña. So that as at the present moment even if we go somewhere, are known to, "Hare Kṛṣṇa!" They say. The whole world will say, "Hare Kṛṣṇa." Either jokingly or serious, it doesn't matter. Let them joke, criticize them, "Hare Kṛṣṇa," still they will have the effect. Still they will have it. In the Nṛsiṁha Purāṇa there is an instance that a Mussulman was attacked by, what is called? Boar having . . .

Parivrājakācārya: Tiger? Boar. A wild boar.

Prabhupāda: A wild boar. So when the boar attacked him the Mussulmans, when they do not like they say, "Haram. Haram." Condemn means haram. So when the boar attacked him he said haram. "Haram!" But it acted, ha rāma, and he got salvation. Do you follow what I say? A Mussulman said, ha ram. Ha ram He condemned. It is abominable. That is the meaning of Urdu, haram. But at the time of death, when the boar attacked him, he said, "Haram." So it acted ha rāma. Ha, he rāma. It acted, chanting the name of Rāma, Hare Rāma. He meant something else, but it acted as beneficial as chanting He rāma. So therefore this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, either you chant seriously, or those who are criticizing us, jokingly, the effect will be same. So anyway let them chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Do you follow? Even they do not take it seriously, if they imitate, joke, still they'll be benefited .

Parivrājakācārya: Should these be straight saṅkīrtana, no . . . should these be . . .

Prabhupāda: Well, they . . . as we install our Deity and chanting, dancing, offering ārati. This interests.

Parivrājakācārya: Not electric guitars and all that.

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Parivrājakācārya: Good. Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Electric guitar, if it is, they chant Hare Kṛṣṇa only, nothing else, then it is all right. But as far as possible, simply mṛdaṅga and kartāl. But if GBC thinks that it attracts more people so they give contribution, that is a different thing. Otherwise there is no need.

Parivrājakācārya: I think nothing can attract like mṛdaṅgas and karatālas.

Prabhupāda: That is practical, we have seen.

Parivrājakācārya: When we put guitars, it waters it down. It doesn't have the same effect.

Prabhupāda: All GBC members should organize like that. Then everything will be all right. And sell books. Now you . . . what is the name? Maṇḍalībhadra, he is slow. So you translate.

Haṁsadūta: Okay. Because there are others, they are competent. I have others, they are competent.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Simply you check that they are not writing nonsense.

Haṁsadūta: Oh yes. That I can do.

Prabhupāda: That's all. And print it and distribute. And another thing. If you can print yourself, it is all right, But if you want printing cost from the general book fund, then whatever you sell you deposit there. You deposit and take, deposit and take, deposit and take. Then when, even if you have no money you'll get money. And then you deposit. But if you spend it, then you cannot expect from the general book fund.

Haṁsadūta: No, no. I'm already doing that with them.

Prabhupāda: Jaya.

Haṁsadūta: Whatever they print for me, or whatever Bali prints for me, I pay him and I pay 100% mark-up so that there can be some money.

Prabhupāda: So in this way organize and distribute literature, and chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa saṅkīrtana yajña. Then our mission will be successful. Accha, here, they are coming, so we shall make a committee, London building fund committee. In that committee, Mr. Arnold and his wife . . . (break) . . . nicely and organize responsibly. So that can be done provided they have got their own men. Why he's not training the Africans? He should train.

Parivrājakācārya: He hasn't got very many Africans. I think only about two.

Prabhupāda: Then suspend that installation.

Parivrājakācārya: They haven't been making any devotees there.

Prabhupāda: Then there is no . . . (break) . . . and if we conquer our eating then we can conquer our sleeping also. Nidrāhāra vihārakādi vijitau. (break) Don't make fuss. If you are serious, then it is all right. Otherwise, you are young men. If you again give up sannyāsa or you try to marry, it will be scandalous for our society. Don't do that. If you are steady . . . but so far report is you are not very steady. Do you admit this or not?

Kulaśekhara: Yes. Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Then how you can take sannyāsa? It is a very great responsibility. [break] There is no need of taking sannyāsa. If you are sincere in preaching you can do in this dress. Where is the harm? Simply by changing, taking a rod, you'll not become God immediately. You have to work, steadily. What is there in sannyāsa? Do you mean to say taking a rod one becomes sannyāsa? Sannyāsa means you must be sacrificing everything for Kṛṣṇa. That is sannyāsa. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī (BG 6.1) . Sa sannyāsī, he's sannyāsī. Anāśritaḥ karma phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti. You went to Israel but again came back. Why? What was the difficulty?

Kulaśekhara: Well, there's no activity there Prabhupāda. I got attacked on the street. I got very sick and I was attacked on the street when I was on saṅkīrtana.

Prabhupāda: Do you like to go to Africa? It is warm country.

Kulaśekhara: Yes Prabhupāda. That would be nice.

Prabhupāda: So you can go. You can go. And you know Deity . . . (break) . . . and if it is sufficiently left, then she doesn't require further. Otherwise add something. But she'll take after the husband. My mother was doing. Yes. The remnants of foodstuff left by the husband will be taken by the wife. That means if the husband does not eat, she'll not eat. So those things are now dream only. (laughs) Impossible. Just like small child, If he follows the father, catching the hand of the father, she is always safe, he is always safe. Now your so-called independence has spoiled the social life. You know he was married. Where she is now?

Kulaśekhara: Oh, she left. We haven't seen her since she left. I don't know where she is. Three years ago. When she left, Śrīla Prabhupāda, she took some drugs and . . .

Prabhupāda: Drug is killing the whole Western nation. You will be spoiled, you will be finished with this drug habit. You are already finished. America is finished. They cannot do anything anymore. Neither industrialists nor big scholars, neither big fighter. Anything. Simply spoiled. The only shelter is this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Pāpi tāpi yata chilo harināme uddharilo. They can be only saved by this process. They have no other . . . otherwise they are going to hell. All Americans, the so-called puffed up materialist. This is a fact. So if you want to do service to your country, introduce this Kṛṣṇa consciousness to the younger generation. They will be saved. You be saved and save your brothers. And otherwise this poison, this intoxication, heroin, cocaine, and LSD and this and marijuana, finished everything. But if you become steady in one life without deviating for māyā, then you make solution of all problems. That is the duty of human being. Instead of suffering this repeated birth and death, one life sacrifice. What is that sacrifice? What is inconvenience to live nicely, avoiding these four rascal habit, taking Kṛṣṇa prasādam, and chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra and reading all these nice books. Where is the difficulty? Nice life. First class life. Wherever you will go you will be respectable. Anyone will worship you.

Śyāmasundara: Materialistic life is so bothersome. All the time some trouble.

Prabhupāda: Just like in hog civilization. That's all. They are thinking that, "We are very happy eating stool." But others know that what kind of happiness he is enjoying. Similarly these rascal karmis, materialists, they are thinking by . . . what is called? Kini . . . what is called? Naked skirt?

Devotees: Miniskirt?

Prabhupāda: Miniskirt, trying to show the private part and people will be attracted and she will be happy. This is regular prostitution. Regular prostitution. Still they are not getting husband. Even they walk naked . . . that will come. Say after fifty years it will come like that.

Śyāmasundara: They are starting already some places, walking naked.

Prabhupāda: And the law is you cannot marry more than one wife. The rascal lawgiver. So many women, there must be . . . one husband, at the present moment, must marry at least one dozen wives, otherwise they're going to hell. At least, she will know that, "I have got a husband." Maybe the husband of twelve wives, but they are anxious to have a husband. That facility should be given to them. They are anxious.

Parivrājakācārya: But they don't want to have any children.

Prabhupāda: That is next program. Why not? Now we are having our wives, so many children. Los Angeles full of children. So natural way should be accepted. They require husband. The law is, "No. You cannot have more, you cannot marry one wife." The girls have become prostitute. That's all right. "The girls are becoming prostitute. That's all right. But you cannot marry more than one." What is this?

Śyāmasundara: They have contraceptive pills even for young children.

Kulaśekhara: One barrister, one of the top judges in England, a top man, top doctor, he said children should have sex life at fourteen. He said this in the newspaper two days ago. He said children at fourteen should be allowed to have sex life. He said this should be made legal. He's a top doctor or judge.

Prabhupāda: Children?

Śyāmasundara: Children should be allowed to have sex life at fourteen years old.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is psychological. They develop . . . sex life, sex urge is there as soon as twelve years, thirteen years old, especially women. So therefore early marriage was sanctioned in India. Early marriage. Boy fifteen years, sixteen years, and girl twelve years. Not twelve years, ten years. I was married, my wife was eleven years. I was 22 years. She did not know what is sex, eleven years' girl. Because Indian girls, they have no such opportunity of mixing with others. But after the first menstruation, the husband is ready. This is the system, Indian system.

Śyāmasundara: So they are not spoiled.

Prabhupāda: No. And the psychology is the girl, after first menstruation, she enjoys sex life with a boy, she will never forget that boy. Her love for that boy is fixed up for good. This is woman's psychology. And she is allowed to have many, oh, she will never be chaste woman. These are the psychology. So these rascals, Westerners, they do not know and they are becoming philosopher, scientist, and politician, and spoiling the whole world. They can be saved only by this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. There is no other way. Otherwise they will lick up their skyscraper building and everything will go to hell. We have seen in New York, so many houses fall down. In New York. Yes. So many. Simply garbage. I have studied. Simply full of garbage. Nobody is going to take care. And the boys and girls loitering in the street as hippies. This is a very, very, bad sign. You see? No home, home neglected, no regular life. The whole nation will be spoiled. It is already spoiled. The poison is already there. Fire. Now it is increasing. Just like you set fire, it increases. So that fire is already there.

Śyāmasundara: And the Russians and the Chinese, they are training to take over. They are marching, practicing war.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Śyāmasundara: In Russia we noticed every day they're practicing for war, young people, marching.

Prabhupāda: Mechanical.

Śyāmasundara: Yes. In China too, marching, ready to take over.

Kulaśekhara: When we were in New York, one boy . . .

Prabhupāda: No, there will be fight. That is the prediction of great politician. There will be war between these Communist and anti-Communist. There are two parties now. The anti-Communist will be defeated. The Communists will come out victorious.

Śyāmasundara: We don't want to fight. None of our boys want to fight.

Prabhupāda: They also do not want fight but they are forced. They do not want to fight. Because they're . . . kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ. In the Kali-yuga everyone is śūdra. What he'll fight? Fighting is not the business of a śūdra. It is meant for the kṣatriya. And nobody is being trained as kṣatriya or brāhmin. Everyone is being trained as śūdra or utmost vaiśya, how to make money. That's all. One class of men is being trained how to serve and get some money, another class is being trained how to make money by exploitation. That is capitalist and communist. The communists are the śūdras. They are protesting that, "You are exploiting us and getting money. It must stop." That is Communism. Is it not? And the vaiśyas, they are trying to exploit others. Some way or other bring money. So there are these capitalists and śūdra and vaiśya. There is no kṣatriya, there is no brāhmin. Therefore the whole social structure is lost. So we are trying to create some brāhmins. And people if follow our instruction then whole social structure is again revived. Hare Kṛṣṇa. So we have got very serious mission. Don't be fickle. When you have come and sacrificed your life for the mission, don't be fickle. Be very steady and capture Kṛṣṇa's lotus feet tightly. You'll never be attacked by māyā. Otherwise as soon as you give up Kṛṣṇa, māyā is ready. Just like side by side there is sun . . . shadow and light. If you push little from light then go to shadow. This is already side by side māyā and Kṛṣṇa. So as soon as you forget Kṛṣṇa- māyā. As soon as you give up māyā, then Kṛṣṇa. (pause) So Pradyumna is transcribing everyday?

Śyāmasundara: Yes. He doesn't work here. He works over at the library, British Museum.

Prabhupāda: Where is that?

Śyāmasundara: Just down the street.

Prabhupāda: He takes them.

Śyāmasundara: I don't know. I guess he does. He's gone all day. Every day he's gone. He says it's too disturbing to work here, too crowded.

Prabhupāda: That may be.

Śyāmasundara: I think he's doing it by longhand, writing it out because he doesn't take a typewriter.

Prabhupāda: So make arrangement, whatever thoughts are coming I am giving you. Ārati is finished?

Śyāmasundara: In about two or three minutes. Five. You'll hear a conchshell.

Prabhupāda: Everywhere this class must be there, morning evening class. Either it is festival or temple. If you go on simply festival, you don't require to start many centers.

Śyāmasundara: Yeah. Starting more centers is not necessary.

Prabhupāda: No.

Śyāmasundara: We have the big cities covered. If people want to go and join us they can go to the big city and join.

Prabhupāda: Because opening center means so much responsibility.

Śyāmasundara: So much. Land . . .

Prabhupāda: So better open. Deity will be there. Just like Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja is doing. Install the deity for one week. You know everything. You have done in Calcutta, Bombay and other. Same thing. You were in Allahabad also?

Devotee: Yes, I was there.

Prabhupāda: Allahabad, Gorakhpur. So same thing. And for persons spiritually inclined, for them this traveling is very good. Traveling means with this occupation. It is very good. You'll be more popular and there will be no difficulty, mind will be steady.

Śyāmasundara: It takes away our attachment for everything materially.

Prabhupāda: The Gosvāmīs, they did not stay underneath a tree for more than one night. So you decide, then you do the needful.

Haṁsadūta: When should we arrange for Śivānanda's fire ceremony?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: We should have initiation too, first initiation.

Haṁsadūta: Do it all the same.

Śyāmasundara: Yes. So we'll consult Pradyumna and find a good time, calendar, on the . . .

Prabhupāda: Any day. (end)